When i was a kid (or when i was in Nepal), i used to believe in God. I did however have reservations on religion but i still believed in God. Its been a year in US now and having met people from other cultures, the existence of a supreme being doesnt make sense anymore. 

I think that believeing in GOd instills in a person faith, confidence and positivity to get through good times and be appreciative of the bad ones. I want my children to have these qualities so i dont want to tell them that GOd doesnt exist. Moreover, i cant imagine what my parents/relatives will make of me when i talk to them about this. It isnt going to be pretty. 

It does give me great discomfort to think about all this. I must admit i feel less confident and more pessimistic these days. I want to believe in God but my logic doesnt give in anymore. In fact, i get irritated when i hear things like "God COMMANDED you to.." "GOd will PUNISH you if..", "We are SERVANTS in from of Him" "(on Christianity): "Jesus died on the cross for you"(THere are many who have made a similar magnitude of sacrifice). 

I think that God and religion are ancient theories that havent been discarded yet. And it hasnt due to the fear in people of what might happen if they didnt. One of my teachers once said "if there is no god and you believe in god, there is no harm but if there is god and you dont believe in god, there is harm". i feel this and cultural and social stigmas lead people to be religious and not question their beliefs. 

I wanna know what you guys make of this.

 Personal experiences and claims:
a) I prayed to god so that I would win the lottery, and I won. Hence, god exists.
b) I prayed to god to pass me SLC, I failed in 4 subjects. God doesn't exist.
c) I had a dream last night where god appeared to me. Hence, god exists

Can't you find the flaw in the logic above? YOU CAN'T GENERALIZE SOMETHING OUT OF YOUR PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. The fact that you can feel god doesn't prove the existence of it. You have to come up with hardcore evidence and irrefutable reasonings if you want others to believe in it. 

And babal khate, I don't see what you have found inappropriate in this discussion thread. People have different opinions and so far in this thread they have advocated for things that they believe in. If you find a better place than sajha, and if atheists are welcome there, please let me know, I would really appreciate that. And the way you brought politics and nationalism (the Indian's example) was as much out of context as homey ji bringing in the instance of Prithvi Narayan Shah. 

@ Babal Khate: I won't necessarily believe whatever you write here but at least I will read it and won't say you are wrong simply because I don't agree with you. So Sajha is the place and one of the best among its kind where you can share whatever you want with some respect to others.

so far there has been no proof provided for the claim of existence of GOD , people are dodging the bullet by posting personal opinion as claims of proof.

i feel i was abducted by an alien is not a proof that aliens exist.

This age old question in itself is wrong.
Wrong because there is no universal definition for God. For hindus, it is one (or million) thing(s), for Christian it is another thing and so on. Even within a religion we have our own definition of God.
Mahakavi Devkota’s God was different from Kavi Shiromani Poudyal’s God. For some it could just be that feeling of inner peace; for other it could be a material existence that created us all and is the ultimate super power.
Buddha went in a quest to find the answer to his question and he must have narrowed it down to actually finding God; as that could be the ultimate quest. After over a decade of not finding God he realized that the answer lied within himself. Peace was his answer and he achieved this answer through inner peace within himself. He went to preach this knowledge, possibly without knowing that people will eventually take him as the incarnation of God later…contrasting the very theory that he concluded himself.

Coming back to the question, religion is a belief. Some people believe it others don’t. It is best to respect the beliefs of others and not force your own belief onto them. You can argue about the existence, or lack there of, forever and you will never reach a conclusion. I can easily offer an answer to somebody who claims there has to be a God and I can do so for the atheist as well. I will continue to respect the beliefs that my folks have and continue with my own.

Babaal,

I don't think being open-minded about all things all the time is necessarily the solution. You don't want to be open to disease and germs and things that could harm you. Being open to all things all the time is as bad as being closed-minded to all things all of the time. The difference between the educated and the uneducated is that educated people know what they are open to and why. The uneducated is either open to everything. Or he goes the other extreme in trying to protect himself and is closed to everything.

Very few have struck the healthy balance. Very few people know what they are open to and why. Very few people know what they are closed to and why.

But you are right. If we understood these things, we Nepalese would come one step closer to being able to talk around the table as brothers and sisters instead of fighting like dogs on the streets.

I realize I believe in "God" at moments of extreme ecstacy or in times of deep despair. Yo naughty ladies in here! you know what I am talking about  with the first one?

Or when I am in mood for some funny stuff like this.

That's good, TM. You feel that secularism has all the answers that you will ever need for life. At least you are not confused...in the middle...not knowing whether to believe in spirituality or secularism. You are in a better position than so many others. You should be proud of yourself.

You are fully convinced in the religious dogma of secularism.  It seems you subscribe to bhajans from MTV and your scriptural stories must come from Hollywood and Bollywood? 

And,  I'm imagining your God is...umm...Dr Evil?

Homey Ji, 
                 Here is my attempt to answer your questions. I know many people here may mock my story and label it mere imagination; rest assured, these are my genuine life events:

I had a framed image of "kali ma" that I had brough with me when i came here to the US in fall 2004. All my meditation, crying, laughing, self-talking, etc used to occur before her. I'm not going to share any spiritual experiences with Kali ma here, as it will just make my writing lengthy.
Around a year later, I had a dream: an old man was dictating to some youths, and i was hearing his dictation/orders from a distance. The old man started walking, and the crowd was following him wherever he went. I was also following the crowd.

Next day, as usual i sat for meditation, and had some deep experiences. I attributed my experiences to the dream that i had that night; i thought may be, the man who i saw in my dream, had blessed me or something.

After coming from school, i was listening to a lecture on samadhi in youtube from some guru. In one of the related videos, i was surprised to see the video about the same man i had seen in the dream earlier. I was surprised, because i had not expected that the man i saw in dream actually physically existed. He is since then my idol, and i follow him.

About ashram, yes. On december 2007, i went to Nepal and took even my mother to his Ashram in Haridwar, India. Though i had already found out that he had left his physical body long time back in 1990 AD when i was mere 6 years old.

"Aatmavat Sarva Bhuteshu"- meaning you and everything else are the same, or everything else besides the physical you is the same as you yourself.

Stated in terms of quantum physics- "Matter and waves are the same, as evidenced by the dual nature of light (both particle and wave nature). You and I, though seemingly matter, are waves at the same time. Also, everything that you see is waves. Waves are nothing, but propogations of energy, which agains implies, that you and everything around you is nothing but energy"

Personal opinion : Each statement mentioned in the Vedas are fit to be considered in a PhD physics research thesis.

Of course, i believe in God. Everything that i see around, including myself, are manifestations of that Supreme Energy. Only thing lacking is a solid self-experience of thee.

 @ risalsa
   Another funny comment. Vedas are same thing as Phd in physics. You either don't know Vedas or you have know clue of contemporary research in Physics. And quit cherry picking one vague line out of nowhere to mean this big unifying theory. If Vedas were so enlightning then why don't hindu's develop or invent anything ??  


If Hindu's knew all this they should have made Ipad 1000000 years ago !!!!

Well i was born and raised as Hindu.And i considered myself to be a strong believer as i used to be vegetarian used to fast and visit temples as often as i could. It was 2006 when i came to USA. Here i heard to Jesus for the first time in my life. i thought its good . Jesus is good . i have so many gods in my life why not one more. I started paying more attention to Jesus and Christians around me. But slowly it just started pissing me off because they keep telling me that there is just one god. Which i just could not digest. i had a problem with that . big problem i thought what a haters its my way or high way. i personally used to think that i am a good person i mean someone who deserves to go to heaven. i have helped poor . and have tried to to good to others. In my views i was righteous enough.So i started battling thoughts.. It was driving me nuts . So i cried out to God asked Him to reveal truth to me. One day i was just staring at the cross and its insane but that is what happened to me. He revealed himself to me. I just understood that Jesus is the only living God. How i cannot explain. Before when i tried to read the bible  i could not understand a thing but after my experience the words on the bible came alive to me. All the questions i had about life and death i had answer to everything. As i got more involved i saw the awesomeness of our God . I saw people being healed in front of my eyes. Peoples life beings changed. people being healed from cancer, aids. who else but just one . true God can heal people like this. Not only that He has even raised people from death. Its laughable for those who do not know him. But for believers it all makes sense. God is a God of power. Believing in Him is not for Him its for us. So how do you know what i am telling you is truth? Simple if Jesus is the only living God then you can simply ask him just like i did. Ask him to show you if He is real. And He will because He is God . He can do anything. All you gotta do is ask. ..

 Sajha is getting very interesting with Christards starting to hang out here. If he revealed himself to you then suck his penis and swallow the gravy.  He is the only living god so the gravy has extra protein. Enjoy the jesus juice while it lasts !!!

Very interesting discussion. I am pretty spiritual. I never believed in Religion because the stories were simply bogus. Sometimes I had felt like I experienced god like what other people are talking about here but now in hindsight, I just believed what I wanted to believe without looking at all the evidence. Some of the events like what mazzareala or mero_desh describes are purely because of the figment of imagination. The mind is very powerful. It can create things that doesn't exist. That's why people go crazy and describe seeing gods or aliens, because that's what they constantly think about day and night and that's what the mind manifests to you. Having said that, all the religious people I've seen are eternally depressed people. They rely on god to cure their depression. They either went through a bad childhood, some kind of trauma like loss of business, or failed their exams, lost their loved ones, poverty and so on. I have yet to see if believing in god cures depression or makes it even more worse because I haven't seen anyone being cured by god.  
Final word on religion. All religions especially Islam and Christianity are trapping poor, gullible, and eternally depressed people and preaching them hatred towards other religion, culture, women, gays etc. I seriously hope that someday we will be able to get rid of the plague known as religion and make much more progress in terms of science and technology. But I always think as long as there are people who want to hurt/kill fellow human beings because their imaginary friend from heaven told them to do so or gave them the right to do so  (a.k.a Delusional) it may never happen. 
F(UK ALL religions. Let us be open minded and do stuffs for humanity not for going to heaven.

 

FountainDew,

You make some excellent points.
But, they are not exclusively and only related to religion.

Think of corporate marketing. Think of advertisement. Think of brand wars. All of these are indoctrinating their own dogma on people. You are right. The mind is very powerful. And it is this power of the mind that Coca-cola uses to sell sugar-water as nectar of the gods. It is this power that Gucci uses to pay $2 to some South Asian child worker to make a purse and then to sell it for $200 in New York. It is this power allows paintings and music to be sold for millions of dollars.

Are you complaining about all of these things?

Having said that, the consumers who do not get all the above products, feel that they cannot live without it. They would feel deprived and their lives would feel meaningless. They would be sad. Many of these people feel that these corporate brands would cure them of depression and their misery. I have yet to see if believing in everything that advertisements on TV tell you is a permanent cure for a lack of meaning of one's life.
If anything, you're working like a rat in the race, trying to make ends meet all the time. Trying to earn enough money to your superficial friends. I haven't seen anyone being permanently cured of sadness by any corporate brand, unlike what they all tell you.

Are you complaining about all of this also?

Finally, all these brand wars is causing a lot of hatred between people. There are people fighting which brand is superior and which is inferior. Capitalism brings about all kinds of it's own problems around the world. Look at the streets of Kathmandu and tell me what this culture of materialistic showing-off has produced of our nation. As long as people can don the latest and greatest brands that Madison Avenue has advertised, people in Nepal feel they don't need to have any morality or responsibility for what happens to the nation. They are living in corporate Nirvana. They are in heaven. They don't need anyone else's blessings or approval.

My friend, Are you complaining about all of this, also?

Look at the 'take back Wallstreet' movement or the 'green movement' and the demonstrations happing against APEC in Honolulu this week. These movements have sprung out of needing to fight against the absolute grip of the power of Capitalism all over the world.

Are you complaining about all of this also?

So, I agree with you. There is a lot of work and attention to be focussed on practical problems happening on earth that concern us Nepalese than to spend all of our time in either loving religion or hating religion. Do you agree with me or not?

HomeyJi
You make good points and I agree with your reasoning. But I'm talking specifically about religion in this case. And I don't want to digress from that. It's OK to be spiritual and believe in supreme being as long as it doesn't affect anyone else. But use common sense. You don't want to drink coke every single day or shove it down the throat of someone who just wants to drink water. But that's exactly what religion does to you. That's what I'm complaining about. If you are happy paying money to the instution that goes about and molests kids, then it's your choice to do so. But logical point of view is to give money to instution like United Nations who actually are involved in humanarian efforts without religious motives. 
I had a catholic friend who turned agnostic later in his life. I asked him why. He said from the time he remembered till he was an adult, he used to go to church every weekend with his family. He wanted to become a priest and devote his life to god. So when he finished school and started working at church he noticed that the people around him were very corrupt. If they needed money for themselves, they would devise plans to extract money from people by emotional blackmails and giving them false hopes (Like god will be pleased with you if you donated $2500). They would then use the money for their own benefit. Having seen all that, he lost complete faith in those institutions. I am fortunate that I never had to go through that kind of episode since I always viewed religion as a big business and nothing more just like pashupati bhattas hoarding up the money. It's very funny that people spend thousands of rupees to make god happy while giving pennies to disabled and homeless people sitting outside the temple. That is because people are so brainwashed by religion ever since they are born that they choose religion over humanity. 
Like I said. I'm a spiritual person. I believe in humanity and I do things in those terms. Not for going to heaven or pleasing god. I go to temple sometimes not because I think I'll get something in return from god, but because I want to do that for my family to make them happy and follow certain good aspects of our culture and preserve it from dying (Like recieving tika during dashain)
May Humanity Prevail and Organized Religion die!!
Peace!!

FoundainDew,

Reading your second response made me realize what a waste of my time responding to your first post was. I should have just said, "Yes Fountain Dew, you are 100% correct." This way, both of us would have been happy. And I could have invested that energy on another person who was worth my time.

 The final answer is, god doesnt exist. If anyone of you mistakenly believe in god and his hometown so called 'heaven' you would be better off killing yourself to be with him in heaven. 

Yes, you are 100% correct.

I am not going in altercation with this issue. For me, yes there is God. However, In a common sense i don't believe in something that says God is one who exhibits a miracle in a corporeal way and resides in most  angelic place so called "Heaven". I am proud that my parents brought me up in a progressive hindu religion and allowed me in my own effort to believe in divinity. I also don't believe in fellow hindus who try to bulldoze their verison of God in me. I have my own version of religion and i believe in humanity.

Forget this crappy debate and try to get away from illusions, and yes
Adhere to the path of humanity you will see all kinds of miracles in your real life. You will indeed find God if you follow the path of humanity. Om tat sat
Religion----- _> Humanity---------_> God

 It is sad that people loose faith in their religion.

The problem is with those holy priest or particular groups who think they are pure and representation of God. When they behave unethically, people lose faith. If you classify people and community such as untouchable, then you know you are bound to lose faith. Religion may be good, but those who interpret it in the name of god are the worst enemy.

God never tells you to lie, to segregate or to kill animals in the name of God. these are all made up in the name of God so that they can exert control over other communities. Those days are gone. If you arenot telling the truth, people will lose faith and the system will collapse.

just like christianity is in decline in Europe, same thing will happen to any religion (even in Nepal), Every system has to adapt and change according to time.

Any religion that speaks the truth and understand basic needs of our society, that will flourish. One that doesn't, there is nowhere but to go SOUTH.