| Sajha.com Archives | |
| Username | Post |
| Dilasha | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 07:06 PM
"Lolaayeka ti thula timra dui najar ley heridiye malaai chahena arko kehi" When I first heard this melodious song with passionate lyrics that penetrates the soul, I discovered two brilliant phenomena- two significant "hastis" who have succeeded in laying a deep impact in the hearts of many nepali music lovers. And these romantics are none other than the Late King Ma B B Shah who penned these very words that would make any woman live in a fantasyland making her wish that her loved one would also scribble some words of admiration for her just like the lyricist. And the second hasti is the singer who with his soulful rendition of many geets and ghazals like "kina kina timro tasveer", "gajalu ti hula thula ankha" "chupke chupke raat din" have continued to enamour us- yes, it is the famous Pakistani singer Ghulam Ali. I do not know whether the partnership of Ghulam Ali and Ma B B Shah prolonged to produce other memorable songs and whether or not he has collaborated with other nepali musicians and lyricists in the past. However I and I bet many of you know that he IS a remarkable singer who has augmented the notion that "music" has no boundaries. Too bad for those of us who are overseas who will miss the opportunity to see him perform live in Kathmandu on August 14. I guess all I could do is pull out the tape once again and enjoy the mesmerizing songs that no one could have sung better than the inimitable Ghulam Ali. |
| Biswo | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 07:52 PM
Dilasha, Gulam Ali didn't sing any other songs than those four songs, that was what I read long ago. The tradition in which Mahendra grew up was quite eccentric from today's point of view. One of the major forms of entertainment was launching of Urdu drama in the palace. Diverse actors would practice all day to please their masters. Urdu was considered the language of art, as the royals were the first one to doubt the ability of our language to convey love and passion. So, when Mahendra became the king, he invited Gulam Ali to the palace. That's where Dipak Jangam was asked to create a great tune, and MBBS wrote the ghazals. To put it in perspective, a few years before the recording of these ghazals, the father-in-law of two of Mahendra's brothers, Himalaya and Basundhara, had invested in a Nepali movie which also starred some famous Indian actors, including actress Mala Sinha. Even when it was being shot in Bombay, the royals, dazzled by the glamour of Hindi cinema world, made several visits to the set of the film.In fact, the government of Nepal helped Mala Sinha out of income-tax morass that she got into after she signed the film. When the shooting was undergoing in Pokhara, king Mahendra gave the producer, Nara Shamsher, a jeep as a present. The movie was Maitighar. A great way to squander national coffer. Anyway, I am glad that now Gulam Ali will be singing to the audiences, eventhough he surely will have a meeting with king Gyanendra, I assume. |
| psychodreamer | Posted
on 12-Aug-03 07:57 PM
Something in come between me and Dilasha :) |
| suva chintak | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 10:21 AM
With due respect to our most learned Bishowjyu, I have some difficulty with what he posted here. You say "One of the major forms of entertainment was launching of Urdu drama in the palace. Diverse actors would practice all day to please their masters." Come on Bishow jyu, let us learn to give credit where it belongs. By patronizing arts, music and drama in their courts, the much maligned royals laid the foundation of fine arts in Nepal or anywhere else in the world. Where would Shakespeare be without the Court of St. James, where would Mozart be without the Austrian and German royal houses? In those days there were no commercial markets to sustain the arts, so the royal families patronized and promoted the arts. Was that sinful to have done? And you say that they practised all day to please their masters. Isn't that what professionalization of art is? You are freed from other concerns so that you perfect your art so that you pleasing to your masters who pay for your upkeep -- whether they be aristocrats in the bygone era or the general public now. Consumer is king, remember? You say "Urdu was considered the language of art, as the royals were the first one to doubt the ability of our language to convey love and passion." A century or two ago, was there any doubt that Urdu was both the language of poetry and governance in South Asia? It was the language in which the great poets of that time expressed themselves, so it naturally had a large published base than any other language at that time. So what is wrong if some, including the royals appreciated that?" I think it is cheap nationalism to say have to read only Nepali plays to be a true Nepali. Someone else would then say you have to stay in Nepal to be a Nepali... "as the royals were the first one to doubt the ability of our language to convey love and passion." Man, this takes the cake! How and when did the royals doubt the ability of our language? If you read PN Shah's Dibya Upadesh, you would realize how swadeshi he was in matters of art, drama, music, industries, faith and so on. And, if you think Mahendra was such a Urdu freak, why then did he go on to write some of the most eloquent love poetry in the Nepali language? Why did he go on to make Nepali the language of public education? Why did he order all the textbooks to be written in Nepali? By the way, do you think that it is wrong for Nepalis to learn Hindi, English, French, Chinese, Greek etc. because it shows that we do not have faith in our own language? Or does the mere fact that we are dabbling in English in this site make us royals since we don't seem to have faith in our language to express ideas or to communicate? You seem to be dismayed by the prospect that Gulam Ali might meet King G. Why begrudge that? After all, the royals in Nepal are one of the oldest and staunchest fans of the gazal mastero. And I think they also accord him a lot of respect and appreciation for his great talent. I attended a Gulam Ali show in Academy Hall in Kathmandu some years ago. After he had sung about three of his most popular Urdu gazals, you know what the audience began to demand? They began chanting for him to sing "Cholike Piche Kya Hai", and "Chhiyan Chhiyan" from the Bollywood movies! A few discerning souls among the multitude were aghast at the crude and vulgar response. Most folks in the audience it seems did not understand any Urdu or had any appreciation for his great singing style. Ali was so dismayed by the response that the organizers had a difficult time convincing him to continue with the show. Things became a little better when he sang Mahendra's Nepali gazals. Such is the world of art and artistic appreciation, and cheap knee-jerk kaite reactions don't help its cause at all. Dilasha jyu, I admire your taste and thanks for raising this thread. SC, the occasional gazzler (our own very promising Muralidhar prefers to call it 'gital') |
| Qallu | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 07:20 PM
Well said, Suva Chintak! Biswo's reaction is clearly a response motivated by his anti-monarchist world view. What a pity it is that some not only feel inhibited to enjoy and appreciate great art for made up reasons, but will actually come out in a public forum to spread lies. Oh well! Dilasha, you do have great taste in music. I would have loved to have been in Kathmandu to hear the man. |
| Biswo | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 08:01 PM
>By patronizing arts, music and drama in their > courts, the much maligned royals laid the >foundation of fine arts in Nepal or anywhere >else in the world. Let's focus in Nepal, rather than anywhere in world.Just tell me where it stands in the world among its contemporaries, if Nepal's art was so patronized by royals. >And you say that they practised all day >to please their masters. Isn't that what > professionalization of art is? OK, may I suggest you to watch a French movie that is still available in your nearby Blockbuster? "All the mornings of the world" (Director: Alain Corneau). I really loved that movie and is a great movie to watch. Monseur De Sainte Colombe would tell you what the art is. The true art is not done to please the masters. It is the ingratiation. >A century or two ago, was there any > doubt that Urdu was both the language >of poetry and governance in South Asia I don't know your definition of South Asia. I know the state of Bengal didn't have Urdu, nor would the soutern Indian states, nor would Sri Lanka, Bhutan and Maldives.Urdu being the language of governance and poetry of Nepal? Pardon my ignorance! >I think it is cheap nationalism to say > have to read only Nepali plays to be a > true Nepali. Someone else would then >say you have to stay in Nepal to be a Nepali... I don't know why you stopped there. Please keep on writing. However, the truth is I haven't said anything about who is Nepali and how one becomes Nepali. I myself is a polyglot. >By the way, do you think that it is > wrong for Nepalis to learn Hindi, English, > French, Chinese, Greek etc. because it shows >that we do not have faith in our own language? Did I say that?So, what are you replying? To go more on your replies? Excuse me, I would like to do something more important rightnow.However, I would like to go over them briefly. Personally I like Prithvi Narayan Shah, so your invocation of Prithvi here is utterly irrelevant.As for Mahendra's palace rules, and his patronizing of writers , they are very obnoxious and controversial.Let's take naming of Mahendra Maalaa[Nepali texts of highschool], and Mahendra Pragyaa Puraskaar. I mean come on, you are using nation's coffer to name things after you. I am glad that Mahendra didn't start Mahendra Sambat. And as for giving 'upaadhi' to poets: it was so random that any sane person would laugh at it. Bhanubhakta was called Aadikabi[The first poet]. Is this justice to the poet Sundara Nanda Baadaa who wrote before him?Was it a respect of the poets? |
| Dilasha | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 08:49 PM
Well thank you guys for sharing your thoughts and appreciating my "taste" of music. Although I've enjoyed reading the comments so far, I do hope and would urge you all to have a healthy debate/discussion whatever you may call it and not to turn this into arguments. Having said that, I would like to thank Biswo for the interesting information on how Ma B B Shah's words took the shape of such melodious ghazals. However, when you mentioned that the "Royals were the first ones to doubt the ability of nepali language to express love", I too wonder if that is true because like Suvachintak jyu said, that raises the question as to how Mahendra could have penned such classic lyrics. And as far as naming everything under his name,(like Mahendramala, Mahendra Pragya Puraskaar) perhaps that could have been something initiated by the authorities who handled those committees? that's just my assumption because i've seen funds being named after the biggest donors even if that's something which they may not have demanded, not that there's anything wrong with it....anyways, Suvachintak jyu, thanks for your thought provoking comment. |
| Qallu | Posted
on 13-Aug-03 09:38 PM
Although I've enjoyed reading the comments so far, I do hope and would urge you all to have a healthy debate/discussion whatever you may call it and not to turn this into arguments. What now, pray tell, sweet Dilasha, is the difference between a debate/discussion and an arguement? |
| Biswo | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 05:38 AM
Dilasha, The reasons why he wrote in Nepali can be a lot. He may have loved Nepali.But let's face it, the royal , including Ranas, enjoyed Urdu drama for long in their palace. Most of them would say that Nepali 'lacks the expression power that Urdu has'. This remained a prevalent theme for long.I am sure if you note, I have said 'royals' were the first one to doubt the ability of our language, rather than Mahendra. Now as for naming MahendraMaalaa etc, the buck should stop at royal palace. Given how Mahendra used to micromanage, [a funny glimpse can be found in Dhruba Chandra Gautam's recent "Baadhi", where Mahendra is reported to be carrying a diary to write small things] I don't think he didn't know what's going on in acadamy.And do you think he was using his own money like those other 'donors'? |
| Nepe | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 05:19 PM
If credit should be given where it is due, then I would say, yes, the royal courts all over the world throughout the history indeed promoted art. Not only pure art, but all sorts of art, from.... well, the list is unnecessary. However, I will certainly wonder whether it is the livelihood to the artists that the royals can provide or the creative freedom that they can not provide would more accelerate the advancement of arts. Biswo ji, I have yet to watch 'All the Mornings of the World'. Ghazal was developed when it escaped from the royal court and found limitless freedom amongst the commoners. When it was in the royal court, it was Quasida, in a vulgar form of a very large number of couplets, often more than a hundred, each praising the royals, irrespective of whether they are silly, dumb, tyrant or great. I will leave this topic right here and rather go to Ghulam Ali one of my favorite singer, well, may be that is not an exact word. I will make it clear shortly. ********************************** Dilasha, Having been fortunate to have some rare words of admiration bestowed upon my geet-ghazals by your tasteful self, for very similar poetry that our poet-king MBBS himself created, it is very hard for me to say that I do not share the same passionate admiration for the lyrics of MBBS that you have. There is every likelihood that my negative bias towards the political monarch may have influenced my feelings. However, it would have been a dishonesty on my part if I had lied and not shared my thoughts with a friend like you. Yes, I like every song. But it is the magical voice of Ghulam Ali and the soulful tunes of Dipak Jangham that touches me. The lyrics on their own somehow fail to impress me. May be I expected too much from the poet-king. May be it is a jealousy. May be I feel threatened by a co-artist. The thing in MBBS' lyrics that particularly puts me off, I hope I am not too impolite, is that the protagonist objectifies the woman he is in love. To the protagonists of his songs, the beloved is thula thula aankha, laamo kaalo kesha, chhineko kati, chamkeko naak ko phuli and so on. His beloved is not a person with life, story, dreams, majboori, pain. His songs never wonders what she may be thinking, wanting, hoping, dreaming, fearing, trying to avoid.. All he says is how much he likes her this and that. I am neither a faminist, nor a sadhu-santa. I know beauty exists. Humans and a lot of other animals are genetically programmed to percept the physical beauty. So celebrating physical beauty is just as natural as anything. However, human love, particularly in a poetic form, should go beyond the skin, deeper and deeper, to the heart, where the distinction between the thula thula annkha and chimse aankha, between lamo kaalo kesha and chhoto khairo kesha, between chhineko kati and the pot belly, between jhalkeko naak ko phuli and phuli-less naak blurs. MBBS' songs runs on the particular shape of physical attributes. I wonder if his protagonist was a woman, if she even fall in love with me. My balding head, nepto naak, pot belly and kukhure chhati does not make a good MBBS song. I am probably unusually rude here. However, as I said, I just wanted to share how I feel. Dilasha, I hope you will forgive me. |
| Nepe | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 05:22 PM
Offo ! I forgot to talk about Ghulam Ali. Okay, that for some other time. |
| Biswo | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 06:55 PM
One anecdote I remembered , though no insinuation intended. Years after 2046ko Janaandolan, one writer [probably Khagendra Sangraula] wrote in a prominent national daily: Why are those royals who used to churn out 'good songs' suddenly don't write anymore after janaandolan? A passionate writer writes all the time. If they are having free time, they tend to write more. Chadani Shah gave up a lot of her official positions after the advent of democracy, including chair of controversial Samajik Sewa Rashtriya Samanwaya Parishad. She seemed to be free and inside royal palace all the times. Yet, why she penned no poems in her later days? Even after being challenged? [Yes, they read newspapers in royal palace too!] -- This summer, in addition to fawning literary magazines that we all know, even normally reserved Garima put out an issue with the photo of King Gyanendra in its cover. Apparently, the writers were trying to find out the literary elements in G.Shah's poems that revolutionized Nepali literature world.Pages and pages were squandered in that efforts. For god's sake, when will someone stop this circus in Nepal? -- Talking about the writer royals, it is noteworthy to remember a verifiably writer king of modern Nepal. When king Prithvi was busy conquering small states, what was his heir- apparent doing? Pratap Singh Shah, the son of a capable and strong Giriraj Chakrachudamani ruler, had developed interest on tantrik sex, and had girls for his hobby. He died pretty soon, but managed to write a book [was it Tantrakali?] about Tantra. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 07:35 PM
don't think he didn't know what's going on in acadamy.And do you think he was using his own money like those other 'donors'? Biswo, Yes. The money spent on building the RNA was out of Mahendra sarkar's own pocket. And I am 100% sure on this. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 07:50 PM
Talking about the writer royals, it is noteworthy to remember a verifiably writer king of modern Nepal. When king Prithvi was busy conquering small states, what was his heir- apparent doing? Pratap Singh Shah, the son of a capable and strong Giriraj Chakrachudamani ruler, had developed interest on tantrik sex, and had girls for his hobby. He died pretty soon, but managed to write a book [was it Tantrakali?] about Tantra. Biswo, Wrong!!! Pratap Singh Shah developed interest in tantra and wrote a book on sacred tantrik symbols and tantrik symbolism behind the gods and godesses of Nepal. The book is not about tantrik sex or the kind you see advertized at the back page of Utne Reader. The book by Pratap Singh Shah is " Brihat Purascharyar Nab" I hope this helps. bujhera bhanna paryo ni sathi.. tyattikai raj pariwar le gareko sabai naramaro bhanna ta bhayena ni.. ye baba, sabaiko ramro paxya pani ta hernu paryo ni.. khali afulai maan parena bhandaima tyo khattam jhoor yada yada yada bhanna ta bhayena ni.. tyo ta gyan ko nabhayera agyanta ko suchak ho ni hoina? kina bhane, gyan bhane gyan le ta manche lai sahansil ra binayi banaucha- Bidhya Dadati Binayam! or does it? sanka lagna thalyo yaar! |
| Rajendrarajbansh | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 08:39 PM
don't you guys have anything else to beside writing such a long messages in the forum |
| Biswo | Posted
on 14-Aug-03 09:16 PM
IFji, Of course, I didn't bring the data out of thin air. Babu Ram Acharya's recent book China, Tibet and Nepal probably has something about king Pratap Singh's tantrik sex interest. If not there, please consult Nepalko Mahabharat by Gyanmani Nepal. One of these books should have the record on him. So, Mahendra used his own money to build Royal Nepal Acadamy. Will you please give me the source for this? What was his salary those days? |
| KaLaNkIsThAn | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 03:33 AM
My grandfather, an Intelligent personlaity, took me to Ghulam Ali live when I was a little kid. Despite "bharabhure le pani bujhcha ra" notion, he wanted me to experience the live performance by Ghulam Ali. That, almost 3 hours long show, was like torture for me. But when I came out of the auditorium, I knew I had experienced some divine performance. And there is nothing divine than Ghulam Ali live. Listen to some of his live performances and experience the beauty of playing with the musical notes which are simply awesome. "Dil main ek lahar shi uthi hain kahin" LIVE... ooooh!!! That song takes me to some sacred places mankind are unaware of...!! Ghulam Ali is phenomenon!!! |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 07:54 AM
Biswo, I don't know what you are talking about, really. The book by Pratap Singh, " Brihat Purascharyarnab " is about Dasha Mahavidyas , Amnaya Bheda to understand the various manifistaions of the godesses and purascharyarnab (completion) of various japas . The book also gives information on how to draw yantras of various gods and godesses. So, your information derived from Gyanmani or Baburam Acharya can be best described as misleading and way off from the fact. |
| Dilasha | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 01:21 PM
A very interesting perspective Nepe ji. Thank you for sharing it and no, it does not evoke any rudeness on your part. In fact it made me smile (reading some of the lines) and ponder for a while and made me look back to those words that MBBS once wrote in his lifetime. So thank you for sharing your honest opinion. Perhaps my admiration for his poems has something to do with the fact that those were written by "A King" (at least on a subconscious level) especially when stereotypical thoughts lead us to believe that the Royalties are nothing but "moj masti" ka bhokaa pyasaa beings with no talents of their own. That's what I felt until I discovered MBBS' poetic talent some six years ago. Also that was a time when I was literally tired of hearing songs which had the word "maya" and "mayalu" in every single line in every single song with no real sentiments in them and not to mention some songs that even had double meanings that completely put me off. And here was this song, "lolayeka ti thula timra dui najar ley heridiye malai, chahena arko kehi...sundar muhaar timro chandrama sharmaune ekpalta dekhna paye chahena arko kehi" that just touched my heart. Later I found that the other songs were also written by MBBS. I totally agree with your point that there is much more to a person than meets the eye and it's the inner beauty that ultimately counts. However, we have to admit (which you have in your comment) that generally it's the physical attributes that makes a person curious to explore the inner beauty of the opposite species. This makes me assume that the woman in "gajalu ti" must have been someone the writer noticed or met at some gathering. He must've been so mesmerized by her beauty (thula ankha, kaalo kesh, daant ka pankti, naak ko phuli) that he could not take his eyes off her and that is something I bet everyone goes through at some point of their lives. For someone who had a majestic upbringing lavished with all the materialistic happiness, who was estranged from the common beings, the simple ways of life, the pain and the struggle of existence, I guess we couldn't have expected more out of him or could we Nepe ji? Having said that he also seems to have suffered when he writes: bichoda ko bedana ma jati chaati polcha milana ko kalpana ma tyahi asha bancha kopila ma aansu tyasai mutu bhitra pugcha jati tadha pugchu(au) sadhai najik tyahin huncha Yes Deepak Jangam's music and Ghulam Ali's voice were indeed the icing on the cake. >>>However, human love, particularly in a poetic form, should go beyond the skin, deeper and deeper, to the heart>>>> True. I agree. >>>where the distinction between the thula thula annkha and chimse aankha, between lamo kaalo kesha and chhoto khairo kesha, between chhineko kati and the pot belly, between jhalkeko naak ko phuli and phuli-less naak blurs. MBBS' songs runs on the particular shape of physical attributes. I wonder if his protagonist was a woman, if she even fall in love with me. My balding head, nepto naak, pot belly and kukhure chhati does not make a good MBBS song. <<< :-) ***************************** on the whole, that was a wonderful critique nepe ji....ever thought of being a critic for literary papers? i bet you'll be a good one. |
| Biswo | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 02:49 PM
>I don't know what you are talking about, really. well, I was asking you how did you know MBBS put his own pocket money to create RNA? I didn't know the exact name of the book by Pratap Singh Shah, so asked if it was Tantrakali?, and I have not read that book. I couldn't even find that book in bookstores. However, I believe Babu Ram Acharya / Gyan Mani Nepal because they are respected by their peers. If you have read the book by Pratap Singh and that is how you are claiming that the book has nothing to do with tantrik sex, then fine. But if you are just insisting without reading the book, then please consult what Babu Ram Acharya or Gyan Mani Nepal had written.It is always a good idea to read and respect what peers /seniors have said/written first. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 03:15 PM
Biswo, I have that 4 volume book with me, so, I do know what I am talking about. Brihat Purascharyarnab has nothing to do with sex. Maybe Pratap singh was fascinated with the idea and wrote other books, which I am not aware of, and probably only Baburam and Gyanmani have read it, but so fsr his only published book, Brihat Purascharyarnab, edited by Dhana Shumsher and published by the Royal Nepal Academy has NOTHING to do with sex. Its about learning the Tantrik Symbolism behind the gods and godesses of Nepal. Also, you guys are blaming Mahendra for some sort of commodification or objectification of female body, and that's the most hilarious thing I have ever read so far. Before you go on criticizing someone, you have to understand the context in which those two songs, Gajalu ti thula thula ankha and KIna Kina timro tasvir malai niko lagcha. The young king was deeply saddened by the death of his first wife and old folks who got to know him/work with him say that he had kept a pic of his first queen in his office and everytime he got some time off, he would stare at that Black and White portrait on the silver frame of his late wife and write poems. Appearantly, he wrote many poems which were later published as anthologies, Usiko Lagi and Feri Usaiko Lagi. Also, King mahendra spent his money to build the Royal nepal Academy. As Iw rote earlier, he wanted to have a place for the nepali writers so it was his dream come true. I have no written evidence to support this, but there are many many people in Nepal who can verify this claim. I also think, one has to listen to what others hgave to say and be impartial when judging people. |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 03:17 PM
which those two songs, Gajalu ti thula thula ankha and KIna Kina timro tasvir malai niko lagcha= which those two songs, Gajalu ti thula thula ankha and KIna Kina timro tasvir malai niko lagcha were written |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 03:27 PM
wait for 5 hrs biwso, i'll poist some pages of that book for you to read, then you decide what its about. its 4 in the morning so dont want to wake my family memebrs up :-)... |
| Biswo | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 04:55 PM
>I have no written evidence to support this, That's what I always suspected,IFji. Now, please kindly check, whenever you have some free time, if the government of Nepal allocated money for the building of RNA. >but there are many many people in Nepal >who can verify this claim. Would love to know some of those people's name too, if possible. |
| sparsha | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 08:44 PM
You write ghazals and I have mostly enjoyed reading what you have posted here in sajha. If you were to critique your own work, how would you do? You say However, human love, particularly in a poetic form, should go beyond the skin, deeper and deeper, to the heart, where the distinction between the thula thula annkha and chimse aankha, between lamo kaalo kesha and chhoto khairo kesha, between chhineko kati and the pot belly, between jhalkeko naak ko phuli and phuli-less naak blurs. Look at your own ghazals, Nepeji. What have you been glorifying? Can you still defend your expression? People can write comedy about a pot belly, balding head, and kukhure chhati not ghazals. Aesthetic pleasure dominates certain emotions. Yes, human love should go deeper or beyond skin but how often does this happen? We dont live in an ideal world. We cant be ideal to all. Literature is an expression not a science. Also, a good looking woman could also be harboring an amazingly loving heart. No? Just because someone appreciates physical beauty does not mean he/she is a superficial lover. Or does it? Come on Nepe ji. If MBBS was nostalgic about lolayeka aanka---let him be. I am not saying you shouldnt have said what you did about MBBSs ghazals/geets. You are free to judge people the way you like. I also felt like sharing my thoughts. Thats all. Euta ghazal jaos na ta yahi mauka ma, Nepe ji. Kaso? "malai khutrukkai paryo jethan timro baini le.." what do you think about this? |
| isolated freak | Posted
on 15-Aug-03 09:20 PM
Some of MBBS's famous songs: Aakash ka ti nau lakh tara ganu ma kasari gajalu ti thula thula aankha kina kina timro tasvir malai niko lagcha hey bir hida aghi sari, nahatayee pau ratti bhari garchin pukar aama royee karayee jodale, sakdina herna bhanchin santan thari thari ka ma marey pani mero desh bachi rahos aani poems are good too: bandipure ukalo thado rara "ma" aadi aadi aadi... biswo, fair enough. to answer your question, i was told that by my grandfather, who had the oppurtunity to work with mahendra sarkar for long. |
| manepali | Posted
on 16-Aug-03 05:03 AM
hello all its definetly sad for us whoever are outta ktm to have missed the maestros show! he is the best. its anhonour to have him sing for us and i am really surprised to have her that some people actually asked him to sing " choli ke piche kya hai", can't but laugh at such incredulous act. anyways we got a long way to go before we enrich our literature and poetry the way urdu has established itself. its just so, simply decent. and to all of u who get to listen to him live i really am envious! |
| Nepe | Posted
on 16-Aug-03 01:42 PM
If MBBS' songs indeed have emotional value of his personal tragedy attached to them, I have no problem to accept granting them immunity of literary review and criticism. Otherwise what I said holds good. What I was doing was a literary scrutiny of the lyrics as they are without regards to their backgrounds. His songs unmistakably objectify whoever he is singing about. He looks at his woman as a motionless, emotionless, lifeless object of cold beauty. His lust and obsession to that object and possession is clear, but his care for her own individual life is nowhere to be seen. He only sees her thula thula aankha, but does not care to wonder they might have blinked someday, they might have cried for somebody, they might have held back her tears for some reasons and yada yada. In his songs, our young prince is completely oblivion of the fact that she might have a life beside being prizely possessed ! Lust and love may walk the same road. But they are not the same. Just to be sure, my friends do not misunderstand me, I repeat again, I am not talking about the personal life of MBBS. I am talking about his songs, those sang by Ghulam Ali, about the words in them , about what they convey and do not convey on their own, that is, when they are stripped off of the musical magic of Ghulam Ali and Deepak Jangham and circumstances, if any, disregarded. **************** Sparsha ji, You have put me in a difficult situation :) So you want me to drink my own medicine. Ha ha ! Let's not do that for now. Be kind to me, please. First of all I am nobody to be compared to MBBS. He has published volumes of poetry, he was hailed as one of the brightest poet by literary critics of his time. His songs have been immortalized by the best of the best singers and musicians. On the other hand, I am just an amateur kabi. I havent published a single book. Apart from kind readers of Sajha like yourself, I am hardly known to anybody. Once I sent my literary work (a long love story, was almost like a extra mini-novel) to 'Madhupark' and then to 'Garima'. Both of them rejected it, well, at least I think it was a rejection. Maduparka said it was too long a story. Garima lost my manuscript ! So it wont be fair if you want to scrutinize my works with the same standard one would scrutinize the works of MBBS. ehehe ! Nevertheless, I think, if not claim, the protagonist of most, if not all, of my romantic geet/ghazal indeed looks at his/her beloved not as an object of certain physical attributes but as a person with her/his own individual life. I leave it to the best judgment of avid readers of my geet/ghazals like you. And I am always open to learning. And again, it is not the word but the nuance that matters. And it is often in fine detail that you can distinguish between being objectified and personified, between lust and love. But its not that there is something wrong about the objectification and lust. They are just as natural. Lolayeka ti thula timra dui najar ley heridiye malai, chahena arko kehi (King's love) Lolayeka parelile bolaayeko ho ki Heradaichhu ma tulutulu timro aankha ma (Commoner's love) ****************** Dilasha, I knew you would understand me. So do I. Also that was a time when I was literally tired of hearing songs which had the word "maya" and "mayalu" in every single line in every single song with no real sentiments in them and not to mention some songs that even had double meanings that completely put me off. And here was this song, "lolayeka ti thula timra& Damn.. that's exactly what is in mind too. I dont know if I will be offending sentiments of many, but I have no shame to reveal that among thousands and thousands of Nepali love songs, there are only a few dozens that I can listen and enjoy. Others are a torture to listen ! And yes, in that crowd, MBBS' songs indeed stand out. There is no debate on that. It is only the higher literary standard and scope where I find them not measuring upto. Beside the nuances, I find them weak in structure too. Redundant use of words, inconsistencies and disregard for the rhyme are among some that keep his songs from being masterpieces, in my not so humble opinion. I have not read his 'Usaiko laagi' and 'Pheri Usai ko laagi' to make a full judgment of his poetic talent. But that is also not the intention of this thread, no ? However, I must say, when I read his poem 'aamaa ko pukaar' for the first time, in my primary school textbook, I was indescribably bewildered. At that time and age, all I knew was that being poor or rich is decided by karma, what you do in your poorva-janma. And here was a poem in which the poet was making a mother lamenting about the disparity between her rich and poor children. One funny thing is that I did not know the mother meant the country. I really thought she is a human mother. One of my uncle was rich and others were not. So I had no difficulty to relate it to that. Anyway, I did not know what to make of that helpless mother who was seemingly ignoring the divine rule of karma. That's why I said I was bewildered. It is only later during formative years of my political views, I tried to understand that poem again. It was already too late. Needless to say, I found it utterly hypocrite. Slightly off the topic, but has any Sajhaites got a chance to read Krishna Pahadi's article Prasanga Raja ko Sampati' in NepaliPost dot com ? - http://www.nepalipost.com/nepal.html#17 |
| arun_valley | Posted
on 20-Sep-03 11:55 AM
FYI, Some of these hit songs of Ghulam Ali were recorded by other singers when Ma.B.B. Shah was alive. Ghulam Ali re-recorded these songs in the late 80s with Deepak Jangam's music. Gajalu ti thula - http://www08.powweb.com/~ugiri/songs/gajalu.ram Kina kina timro tasbir - http://www08.powweb.com/~ugiri/songs/kina.ram Feel free to download it to your local machine. (gajaluti_old.rm & kina_kina_old.rm) Disclaimer: This is a attempt to promote old musicians. I will be posting more old songs that are not available in Cassettes/CDs for sale or the internet to download. |