Of course moneyminded, sajha has never been short of interesting topics. It's jsut that time and again issues get toppled this way and that (figuratively speaking... u know), then they are dead. I'm always for well cited research-based discussions when it comes to topics like these. It's fun and a learning experience as well, not that I don't get a kick out of light hearted discussios! One more thing... the above poster's name is Vishontar not Vishnuavtar (you weren't being sarcastic as usual i hope?...:-) Don't forget to post when you do find the origin of Shiv or his khandan. Uzbekistaan? Atlantis? Sounds interesting but do cite the sources/refereces to verify your statements. Goood Luck there! SofT