THE ORIGIN OF HINDU RELIGION

Dear JPEG, The whole texts you have put under the 'Bible of Aryan Invasion' by Uday Naidu and 'Chronology of Indian History' were posted in a website www.dalitstan.org sometimes back, which was banned later on due to its attempt of false exaggeration of Aryan domination over Dravids and so called lower castes in India. The credibility of the contents on those articles can be argued for or against any race's favor. I just thought you would be more wise on posting anything in a public forum that has such a dark and misleading tone against a certain ethnic group, which as a very little or no credibility. (I am talking about the banned website and the article by Uday Naidu, of course.)

Normal 0 false false false MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} I was following this thread and also wanted to post some comments, as I do not posses any depth on the subject matter and I kept my self content in enjoying the info posted by different users. However, reading some of the comments and information posted, I find while kanchu is trying to deny western intervention in a way is trying to defend rich eastern civilization acknowledging different opinions, JPEG postings and arguments seems less receptive, amateur and self contradictory. I do not know, but most of the time we are told not to refer web sources and cite peer reviewed journals or authentic publications. When it comes to sensitive issue, I would rather be 100% sure before posting anything. No offense to JPEG, but bro it seems like you are happy posting what you know rather than getting to the point. For example, many people including less informed person like me would know about chronology/historical development that you posted. No big deal . Again, though I do not believe in any religion, but it seems you are trying to denigrate Aryan, Bramhin or Hindu as a whole. As pointed out by USER 123 I also suggest you not to mislead people by posting less credible arguments. Peace!

. Last edited: 23-Apr-09 06:11 PM

Kanchu Yes, I'm a bit ignorant in these matter. It's not my field, sorry if I annoyed you. I'm not claiming I'm an expert like you but I do have a great interest in history. I keep past and preset in different contest. Yes, present comes from the past but that does not mean we have to live on the glory of the past and not move on. Last time I checked the site around modern day Mahenzo/Harrapa civilization (Pakistan/Afganistan), they are still stuck in their ancient life, pretty backward, even worse than Nepal. So what they were once a great civilization. Again, it is my view. Forgive me if it offends you. I'm a pro Eastern like you but I hate those fake irrelevant pride, like those who think Eastern civilization invented aviation because of the reference of a flying chariot in our old religious book. I've seen many educated Nepali brag about it right here in Sajha. Mix modern medicine of cloning - a human being with monkey- which they probably will do pretty soon, we will call it is a stolen concept of "Hanuman". There is no end to this sort of dumb claims. Hear this...when I was in high school I was told that they detected/recorded the sound wave at the location where the epic Mahabharata took place. I look back with anger and disgust for a kids to be taught with these sort of BS. But I do agree with you that many Western scholars have twisted the facts all throughout the history and has made us look inferior. But then it is up to people like you who are expert to prove them wrong.  Sorry if I've distracted too far away from the topic. I really enjoy reading all the posting.  JPEG..how about some ancient history about Nepal, not just India.

hasundo lagyo yo thread, gyan bata suru bhayera mukha ma adkeko jasto lagyo hai narisaunu pehri afian mukha paryo afu ta!!! rewire lai chain history ko k matlab bhancha pheri jpeg lai nepal ko history rakh bhancha, jpeg chain website bata copy paste garcha, nepal ko history janne ho bhane ta tyetro nepali ithihaskar le lekheko cha book pade bho ni..khoi afulai ta dubai ko kura bachha jasto lagyo! jpeg ko research garne tarika website ho bhane teacher le plagiarism garyo bhanera alu grade dela hai..!

Aparrt from where Hinduism came from and Indian history........ I am very interested in knowing where did Nepali people come from? How did we get divided in to Brahmin, Newars , etc…..?

jaiyeta division ta paile dekhinai thiyo kyara, mathi ka bidwan le ni bhanya chan ni rig-veda dekhi, tara nepal ko case ma chain Jayesthiti malla le caste divide garya ho kyare..khai afu tyeti dherai bidwan parena, idea!!! google gare ra copy paste garaun? ani ma ni bidwan hunchu....kasaile bhane ni nabheneni afain bidwan hunchu yetrai sidhhe..

Normal 0 false false false MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} jpeg, do not take it to your heart, but brother citing websites will never make your research authentic. Today some info are there and tomorrow they are not there that is the nature of internet sources. They are often misleading as well as sometime I find them commercial. That is why information posted on website are not considered credible in research f. You can cite journals, articles which are published already and if that is posted on the website then that is OK. I am advising you because you are doing some kind of research on history, but you have to be very careful about it. Tomorrow you might want to publish your article in some journal but then if you are citing webistes they will not publish your article as your references includes more websources , nor anyone in the research field will give you credit for your hard work, nor you will be able to defend your arguments. If you are taking any course related to research method (assuming you are graduate student) then you should know this, if your professor is not telling you this fact then ask him about this issue. In haste does not copy paste info from net they might be valuable but won’t be considered authentic. This is the reason I was bit critical about you. But no offense.Good luck with your research!

JEPG thanku for links. kitab nai leknu sakcha aba ani Rewire mula, are yu talking apple or oranges?? history ko kura garrna muujjji ani not luftahansa or hanuman . to the point

Normal 0 Origins of Hinduism. Please refer to the book “Vedic Aryans and the Origins of Civilization”, by Navaratna Rajaram and David Frawley, 2001, Voice of India Publication, New Delhi. A short list of important time markers according to the book: 8,000 BC: End of last global glaciations (Wisconsian). 7,000 BC: First indication of civilization – Mehgarha, India 4,000 BC: Early Vedic age (Rig Veda) 3,750 BC: Decline of Rig Vedic age, Ramayana 3,600 BC: Late Vedic age, Yajur, Sama and Atharva Vedas 3,100 BC: Canonization of Veda by Vyas, Mahabharat, River Sharaswati losses Yamuna, Kali yuga begins. 3,000 BC: Brahmanas period, Harappa, Mohenjodaro 2,900 BC: First civilization in Middle East/Europe – Rise of Sumerian and Akkadian empires in Mesopotamia, and rise of old kingdoms in Egypt (early Pyramids). 2,200 BC: Major drought and decline of Harappa 2,000 BC: River Sharaswati loses Sutlej 1,900 BC: River Sharaswati dries, Harappa ends, Zoraster (Persia) 1,500 BC: Iron, Dwaraka 600 BC: Pythagoras 500 BC: Buddha Here are a few brief notes on evolution of Hinduism. Let us clear a few issues first. Hinduism is a collection of Dharmas, not religion. Dharma is not religion. Dharma is about seeking truth (Satya) and spiritual disciplines (Yoga). Dharma should not be confused with non-Dharmic issues like caste or rituals. Caste is the evolution in Hindu society as per motivation and job specializations in the ancient times. Varieties of rituals are mostly cultural expressions. On the other hand, religions are about social control through brain washing, not spirituality. Spirituality is a universal human theme, not limited by history, geography or culture. There are many known and unknown Dharmas in the world. The universal principle is termed ‘Sanatana.’ Hinduism is the subset of Sanatana or Dharmas evolved in Indian sub-continent, e.g. Vaishnavism, Shaivism, Buddhism, Sikhism, Jainism, Tantrism, Charvakism etc. Thus, Hinduism is a geographical definition. It can also be taken as a democratic platform where different Dharmas act. A Dharma is not hostile to another. They are like different branches of science (Sanatana) pursuing different techniques and coming from different lineages. A Dharma may claim to be easy or more rigorous or explains more, but will not condemn others. Physicists do not condemn Mathematicians. Matter of fact, you cannot learn Physics without Mathematics. Religions are always hostile to others. Because, the social control comes from military like discipline and it cannot entertain difference of opinions. A controlled society cannot have multiple ideologies or leaders or cultures or views. Only a free society can have. Members of a religion have to abide by the prescribed belief, ideology and behavior, and essentially are not free. A soldier always sees enemy in another army. A Hindu is not bound by any single discipline. The internal freedom is the first requirement in spirituality. A Hindu learns from different schools and develops own tradition. These individual or family traditions do evolve as new spiritual tools are added and useless ones are dropped. The end of last global glaciations (8,000 BC) is important. Though there were earlier human civilizations, most were lost under the glaciations. As the earth warmed, the tropical areas were first opened up for the denser human habitation, which led to the advanced cultures and philosophical developments. Most probably there were other civilizations also, but as far as we know only ancient Vedic civilization survived. It still took a few more millennia to evolve coherent spiritual ideas. The Indian sub-continent was\is inhabited by all three major races – Caucasian, Mongoloid and Negroid. There are still pockets of Negroid people mostly in South India. Caucasian (not Aryan) people were\are all over India. The Mongoloid (Kirati) people inhabited most of the Himalayan and adjacent region and still do. The term ‘Arya’ is not race but means ‘cultured.’ Indians of any race call them self ‘Arya’ or ‘cultured/better’ as compared to opponents who are labeled non-Arya or less cultured. It is like ‘Gentleman’ as opposed to simple ‘man’ in English. Thus, it is misnomer to classify ‘Indian Aryan’ specific to Caucasian race different from Mongoloid or Negroid races. On the other hand, the theory that ‘Aryans came to India from Europe and displaced original Dravidians’ is not true. Matter of fact, it is the other way. Northern and Southern Indians, so called Aryans and Dravidians, is same people. Ravana of Ramayan was a Brahmin. Some of these people migrated to Iran and Europe much later. And many of the present day Khetriyas are actually Central Asians who came to India later. Here the term ‘Caucasian’ is used as in physical anthropology, not European/white specific. The practices of spirituality in Hinduism are the amalgamation of teachings from all these groups. In general, Dwaita (Vishnu, Narayan) philosophy comes mostly from Caucasian group and Adwaita (Shiva, Mahadev) comes from Mongoloid (Kirati) group. In short, Dwaita teaches God creates us through love, and we can approach God through love. Adwaita teaches the universe is one, which includes our self. It can be realized by going within or meditation. Adwaita uses abstract symbolism of ‘Lingam/Yoni’ to depict the inner consciousness and the physical nature. However, there are other systems also and Hinduism is the composite of all these views. These views are not race specific. The medieval and modern proponents of Adwaita are Caucasians like Shankaracharya and Vivekananda. On the other hand, Kirati people do not limit worshipping only Shiva and practice only meditation. Kirati people include many practices of Hinduism including tribal rituals. The ancient Vedic civilization flourished around now defunct Sharaswati river. The River used to be the mightiest flowing through present day Rajasthan, Gujarat and pouring into Arabian Sea. The Sutlej and Yamuna used to be its tributaries. It is interesting to note that there was no physical river Sharaswati today as described in Veda and thus considered a myth. However, present day technology of ‘Satellite Remote Sensing’ has shown the ancient river and its multiple shifting basins. The ancient long lost city of Dwaraka is also found in the sea by the Gujarat seashore. The first indication of civilization begun around 7,000 BC and Early Vedic period (Rig Veda) flourished around 4,000 BC. However, there was tectonic (geological) shift and climate changes around 3,100 BC. River Sharaswati lost Yamuna and started to dry up. It also marks the Mahabharata age. After passing away of Krishna there was an interesting astronomical alignment of all the planets. It is taken as the time marker between Dwapar and Kali yuga. Also due to the precession cycle (26,000 years) of the Earth’s axis the star alignments described in Mahabharat is considerably different from alignments of today. Because the Sharaswati river basin could not sustain larger population, out ward migration began. River Ganga captured Yamuna and became prominent. Civilizations around Ganga and Sindhu rivers (Harappa, Mohenjodaro) became prominent around 3,000 BC. Varanasi/Banaras/Kasi is considered the oldest continuously human occupied city today. Around 2,000 BC Sharaswati lost Sutlej also. Sutlej became tributary to Sindhu. Around 1,900 BC Sharaswati dried up and Harappa also declined. These ecological changes induced out migration including into Iran and Europe, called Aryan migration. Around 500 BC, Sidhartha Gautam ‘Buddha’ was born in present day Nepal, who revitalized Dharma in Indian subcontinent, Asia and the World. His core message is the existential reality can be realized through empirical means or working within human faculty. It is important to note that up till then standard spiritual practices depended on revelations or belief systems. Thus, ‘you be the lamp on to yourself’ was a major break through. Buddha was teaching an internal spiritual discipline independent of any belief system, not forming an ethnic or political group. Thus, individuals of any background can practice Buddhism. A perfect harmony between the three principal sects of Hinduism in Nepal namely Baudha (Buddha), Shaiva (Nilkantha) and Vaishnav (Narayan) can be seen in the temple in Kathmandu, which we lovingly call 'Budha Nilkantha Narayan'. Satyam ewa jayate. Truth always triumphs. Vashundhaiva kutumbakam. World is a family. Sarve api sukhino santu. Let all be happy. Yeto Dharma stato jaya. Victory is where virtue is. Om mani padme hum. Goodness comes out of goodness. Om shantih, shantih, shantihi. Divine peace, peace, and peace.

jpeg le afno thread bachaune afain post garda garda laj bhayecha tara murkha pine77 bandima manche ullu hundainan harye kothe bdiwan......

Normal 0 Dear JPEG Namaste. I am sure you are loving and honorable like my father in law. Perhaps you have not read the book “Vedic Aryans and the Origins of Civilization, 2001” by Navaratna Rajaram and David Frawley. Since you have read so many scholarly books, reading one more book may be a good idea. The book debunks the theory of the Aryan invasion of the India. It gives a range of perspectives and evidence on the issue. If I were a scholar like you I would pay attention first to the paradigm shifting theories. If you have any questions perhaps you may like to contact the writers. I could not find contact information of Dr. Rajaram. However, Prof. Frawley is in Santa Fe, NM (Email: vedicinst@aol.com, Telephone: 505-983-9385) Meanwhile you may be interested in a few of the web sites: 1. Aryan Invasion Theory Links: http://www.hindunet.org/hindu_... 2. Saraswati – The ancient river lost in the desert. A. V. Sankaran http://www.ias.ac.in/currsci/o... 3. Scientists prove existence of mythical Saraswati river. The Times of India. Date: May 2, 2001 http://www.hvk.org/articles/05... I think you missed my point. I did not minimize the contribution of the Kirati to the evolution of Hinduism. Matter of fact, that is what I wrote. These kinds of studies come always with healthy debate and differing views. It takes some time to shift wheat from chaff and derive a standard theory. Perhaps currently it is going through such mode. Sincerely, Pine77

Hindu religion came from people who eat mushrooms (the infected kind).